Amazon Haul.. what does that imply?

@rockblossom

I’m unsure what “facilitate customs clearance” means for this stuff.

My guess is that it means that Amazon will do as little as possible for you to still follow customs regulations and as much as possible to avoid paying any customs fees or taxes. In other words, “Here are some forms we filled out because we had to. If you have any questions, call somebody else. Buh bye!”

@ItalianScallion I noticed that Amazon will accept returns on eligible items and will refund the selling price when received. Whatever you paid the gov’ment in added taxes/tariffs is your problem. And since any tariff has already been paid, Amazon is free to resell the item for whatever it can get for it.

@rockblossom Now that’s sneaky.

@ItalianScallion Did a bit of research. Amazon may be taking advantage of:

Section 321 of the US Tariff Act, allowed individual packages valued at US$800 or less to enter the country free of duties and inspections.

Source: https://www.china-briefing.com/news/us-trump-tariffs-key-implications-for-chinas-ultra-fast-fashion/

So maybe there will be no tariff for stuff shipped directly to the “importer” of these, and if any are returned to Amazon, they have neatly evaded the extra tax by not importing in bulk. Or the “de minimus” charge will be in effect, and the buyer will still have to pay. Who knows what will be in place on Monday.

@ItalianScallion @rockblossom The De Minimus exemption for parcels with a value under $800 is explicitly eliminated in the up-again-down-again-maybe-104% fiat tariffs, so even something that’s $3 gets nicked for the tariff, and possibly for a customs broker fee (typically not less than $25) and maybe a bonded warehouse handling fee (could literally be anything) and a COD fee (possibly another $25-$50) on top of all of that. USPS has stated that for small-value parcels, the on-top-of-tariff fee will be $25 inclusive.

Bottom line: Until it becomes clear that the administration has decided to concentrate on fucking up something else, and restores the old (saner) policies, juststay away from Temu and Shein and Wish and Haul for anything that’s ship-direct from China.

@ItalianScallion @rockblossom

https://www.whitehouse.gov/fact-sheets/2025/04/fact-sheet-president-donald-j-trump-closes-de-minimis-exemptions-to-combat-chinas-role-in-americas-synthetic-opioid-crisis/

@rockblossom @werehatrack I’m guessing that all along I’ve been considered the importer when I buy something that ships from another country directly to me and that the de minimus exception is what has made it so that I don’t have to file any paperwork and pay import duties. In December I was surprised to find that two gifts I ordered were shipped to me from China. Now I’ll have to pay more attention and/or ask the seller about shipping. I guess I’ll find out about all this soon since I ordered an antique military-issue type of coffee maker and it’s shipping to me from Ireland, which I didn’t realize when I ordered it.

@rockblossom the post office, UPS, FedEx, etc will do manifest clearance for their plane as it arrives into the US. They are currently allowed to do this. Clearance will be based upon the declared value the sender listed in the commercial documents included with the shipment.

The issue w the manifest clearance is that it is riddled w errors and is why most large companies do not allow the carriers to clear their goods. W Fed Ex, for instance, you can select BSO (broker select option), where Fed Ex does a document handover (for a fee) and holds your freight in a bonded area until your broker provides released 7501/3461 documentation. At that point the shipment is removed from thr bonded hold and delivered. UPS has something similar, I just dont recall what its called.

With the removal of the de minimus exemption a clearance will still be done as in thr past, but you will likely be subject to duty (unless your item is duty free or has chapter 98 exemptions), and of course there will be tax charges. I THINK the minimum is something like $25 now, but its been a long while since I’ve handled or oversaw brokerage at a company.

And apparently there is mass confusion in the brokerage world given all the changes happening at lightning speed. Charges should be incurred based upon the rule in effect the day the shipment departed origin, so wheels up for air freight or departure from the port for ocean.

@rockblossom @werehatrack I spoke too soon. After having read the reference werehatrack posted linking to the White House’s statement on the de minimis exemption changes, I now realize it applies only to China and Hong Kong. At least I know now that things under $800 that are shipped from Europe directly to me are still exempt.

@rockblossom @tinamarie1974 USPS had an advisory posted last week stating that the de minimus would be entirely gone as of May 2nd, and the minimum combined duty and COD fee would be $25. On April 8th, the administration tripled down on that and bumped it to $75. (YEOWCH!) What’s not explicitly stated in the (sloppily written, IMO) order is whether the $75 is a minimum, or whether the remitter has the option of paying at the ad valorem rate (90%) for items whose value is below the point at which it would be $75 if paid ad valorem ($83.34). My reading of the April 8 EO seems to indicate that the $75 may be the de minimus flat rate, with the duty assessed ad valorem for $83.35 and above. I think that $75 is almost certainly the minimum rate, but I’m not a mind reader (nor do I want to be, where this is concerned). It appears that there is still a good bit of confusion.

OBTW, unless the tariffs get paused again, the de minimus for China jumps to a ludicrous $150 in June.

More info:
https://www.inc.com/jennifer-conrad/iits-official-the-duty-free-exemption-on-small-shipments-from-china-expires-may-2/91171380
https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/04/amendment-to-recipricol-tariffs-and-updated-duties-as-applied-to-low-value-imports-from-the-peoples-republic-of-china/

@rockblossom @werehatrack the $25 doesn’t make sense as there is a minimum tax rate on top of duty, however I doubt that the folks writing these alerts are always SME’s. Unless thr $25 was their fee on top of the government levied charges.

Also as I said, the brokerage community is besides themselves given all the changes, delays, etc that are being announced on what seems like a daily basis. Believe me when I say no one is clear on the legal path forward and everyone is trying to wade through all the changes.

I think we all need just wait for the dust to settle and see where everything ends up while understanding that any purchases made from the targeted countries may incurr duty, tax and potentially brokerage related charges. One needs to decide if that purchase is worth it, and it likely isnt.

And if you are interested, here is a really good article that delves into the three types of entries that can be filed and their requirements. It also talkes about the origins of de minimus

https://www.cato.org/blog/high-costs-eliminating-de-minimis-shipping

@chienfou It launched a few weeks ago with a delayed imposition date of 5 April.

If you had stuff already on the way that hasn’t shown up, prepare to need lube.

@chienfou Yeah. I think the 'Zon Haul program was in the planning stage last year, thinking they could take advantage of the same small-dollar exemption used by Shein/Temu/et al - which is not there now. There will probably be people who will think: “But it’s Amazon, an American company! I can order for them without a tariff!”

@chienfou @rockblossom Sounds like Amazon is fully embracing the overseas junk-makers in their third-party sellers program, rather than maybe just tolerating it for the sake of making a buck.

@chienfou @ItalianScallion @rockblossom Amazon has a lot of Chinese sellers (who are not always obviously Chinese). They probably want to keep the business, but definitely want to pass on the tax to the buyer.

@chienfou @rockblossom @user98378149 I read a couple of articles from April 8th that said that in response to the uncertainty over tariffs, Amazon is restructuring their Haul program to focus on low-priced goods already in the US, usually well-known brands, rather than the no-name stuff they originally set out to promote and sell, and low-priced US-made goods.

@chienfou @ItalianScallion @rockblossom @user98378149 I suspect that present-in-the-US China-origin goods will get bumped in price dramatically as the tariff date approaches.

Or the administration could declare Great Victory and drop the whole thing again, further increasing the uncertainty levels.

Either way, this whole mess is idiotic.

@chienfou @ItalianScallion @rockblossom @user98378149 @werehatrack or before that. Companies are scrambling to both import and export goods between the US and CN right now. Air freight rates have increased from less than a dollar per kg to $7-$10/kg because of elasticity of demand. The airlines are laughing all the way to the bank and its the consumer who will suffer.

I was speaking with one of my forwarders the other day and they had customers chartering planes to avoid the higher duty rates. In case you are curious, the last time I looked at chartering a plane it was around $200k.

@werehatrack It sounds like you made it out of that disturbing experience ok and I’m so glad to hear that. I find it hard to believe that fentanyl is used with humans knowing the high risk of addiction.

My bad experience was with oxycodone, i.e., Oxycontin, that was given to me for at least a couple of weeks after major surgery and damage to my body after a porch collapse accident. While taking it, I had terrifying recurring nightmares that more than ten years later I can still recall in every tiny detail. Oh, and hallucinations and mindbending so bad that I could not make sense out of an analog clock, and I thought there was a dog sleeping at the foot of my bed (there wasn’t). So, while I won’t use the same intensity as werehatrack against oxycodone, I would urge everyone who might end up taking oxycodone for a legitimate reason to talk to your doctor(s) about disturbing effects. The way it took me out of the world around me makes me understand how it could be psychologically addictive.

Ghods help a China shipper whose containers are on the water now with a US arrival slot of May 2nd or later. I’m expecting some importers to silently evaporate into the ether as the tariff date approaches, possibly even if they’ve paid up front for the goods.

This entire mess is sheer lunacy.

@tinamarie1974 WHOA!

@werehatrack in a big bit of NIMBY, I do worry manufacturing will be brought back to the Western hemisphere in a large scale. Back when there were car and rubber plants in middle America, there was also soot and dust everywhere.

@tinamarie1974 Maybe this will weed out a lot of the who-the-heck-are-they third-party sellers of junk on Amazon.

@ItalianScallion and Etsy!!!

@ItalianScallion @tinamarie1974 If it’s just China and Hong Kong, what’s stopping companies from relaying packages through another country?

@narfcake @tinamarie1974 I’m thinking they would have to intentionally misrepresent/mislabel country of origin on the goods to avoid the China/Hong Long tariffs. Shipping via another country would likely avoid the fine-toothed-comb inspection applied to packages from China and Hong Kong, so some companies might think it’s worth the risk.

That reminds me of the Chinese honey fraud that happened about 20 years ago. Huge shipments of honey from China were refused entry to the US because of the presence of an illegal-in-the-US chemical that was used for pest control in hives in China. That honey went back and was then “ultrafiltered” to remove all traces of any chemicals, along with a lot of the flavor, then shipped back to the US via another country to avoid further scrutiny and labeled as being produced in that other country. The stuff was awful, I heard from other beekeepers, and more like corn syrup.

@ItalianScallion @narfcake they can if they have the infrastructure to do so. They would still be liable for whatever duty/tax is levied from the alternative country, but not st the exorbitant CN/HK levels.

@tinamarie1974 USPS sent out instructions on how to collect customs duties to employees this week. A couple minor changes but basically a reminder to look and get the money.

It is going to be interesting. I think there will be many refused packages and confused people. Not looking forward to explaining and being the messenger.

@speediedelivery @tinamarie1974 So with USPS, is it going to be like the old COD where the postal carrier is the one who collects the payment due and won’t deliver the package unless it’s paid?

@ItalianScallion @tinamarie1974 You will get a notice to come pick it up. The plan is not to send it out with the carriers.

@speediedelivery I feel sorry for anyone involved.

@tinamarie1974 Have you seen anything about creative pricing schemes, like the product is free just pay shipping? Saw an ad and it got me thinking about how the cost would be determined. I know this was a thing on eBay until the cost structure changed.

@speediedelivery not from reputable sources.

That said, it is well known that the Chinese Govt subsidizes product sales, and has for a long time; they allow mfgs to sell below cost and then secure a rebate after product is exported. I cannot imaging them being able to subsidize at full price (allowing zero cost sales), but who knows any more

The other thought, is the flat fees being charged regardless of value are rather prohibited.

I see lots of refused packages in carriers future.

@tinamarie1974 I’m curious what would happen regarding tariffs if a package is refused? If the package goes directly from the source in CN/HK to a regular person instead of through an importer and is refused, are tariffs still due and who would pay them?

@ItalianScallion if the importer refuses to pay, if I recall…the shipment is seized and destroyed or possibly auctioned off.

But its been about 20 yrs since Ive handled/oversaw brokerage.